Tuesday, January 10, 2006

The Wrong Girl

The Wrong Girl!


thec said...

Ok, I've been watching for awhile so I'm not coming at you from way out ... whateverwhere ...

I've read where you say you are coming from. How you supposidly love women and all ...

If this is so, then why do your women NOT have real women faces?


Process Junkie said...

That's your opinion, thank you for expressing it. The fact that you've been watching for a while does not entitle you to squat and it certainly does not make you into an expert on beauty or what a woman should or shouldn't look like. I don't draw thinking of you or what you want to see, I'm not here to entertain you, if you want to jerk off to cartoons, I'd suggest you rent "Cool World" or something of that nature. Just how much did you say you paid to view the contents on this blog? . . . get back to me on that one and I'd gladly refund your money.

In conclusion (and that means don't reply to this reply because I'm done dealing with you), if you're expecting to see the same "beautiful", "make-me-come-in-my-pants, kinda face" airbrushed supermodel airhead bullshit every single time, stop coming to my blog, luckily for you this is a free world and there's a quazillion choices. Go to my friends: Dean Yeagle's site or to Shane Glines' place (wait! this is not free, you're going to have to pay to get your jollies) they're great artists who draw beautiful girls all the time, you won't be disappointed, I promise. Unfortunately, here I do whatever the fuck I want.

Have a nice fuckin' day!

-The Management

El editor said...

I think that is a serious, complete and very good answer to this hidden "Llanero Solitario".
By the way... all the women HAVE real faces. I see these faces everyday in my town: Rosario, Argentina.
Luckily they don´t shoot me !
Volvieron las weapons !

Virginia Valle said...

Ohhh well, I think the girls posted on this blog are beautiful.... Alberto I love this girl :) she look Cuidado conmingo ;)...I like the shape and gesture :)..Truly beautiful work!!

UrbanBarbarian said...

Hey Alberto,
I didn't think it was possible for you to get any better but you keep knocking me out with these drawings. If I was a fan before I don't know what you'd call me know. "Fanboy", I guess... How sad.

The Original Dangster said...

Dang Dude, this chick is wrong in all the right places!...I like my girls a lil dirty or somethin'

Ya think thec sends hate mail to Disney because REAL mice don't wear lil red shorts and bow ties?


jumpman said...

Okay, I may be about to get my face rearranged for saying this... but I'm not 100% certain Thec was sending some major flame here...

It could just be a language barrier thing and he's actually trying to understand your wyahanga style. I mean, he is asking about their faces, not other bits.

I could be wrong. He could be everything you say... but, you know, benefit of the doubt and all...

And besides, do you only want people who are going to pat you on the back to post here? I know criticism hurts and it can be a real motivation killer, but some questions can make us think and grow.

I once bought an issue of PvP. In the letters section, Scott Kurtz ripped through a girl who'd sent a letter in questioning something he'd done. I'm sure I didn't know the full story, but he was a real pratt about it. I've not bought an issue since.

People ask a lot of other people, especially talented people. We expect our stars to be thin, beautiful, talented, gregarious, always available, super nice. And that's unfair. People are just people, no matter who we are, or how special the world perceives us...

Even me... AND my mixed-up thoughts.

All that said, I personally dig 'The Wrong Girl'! And that includes her face. :)

antonio said...

Alberto has understood since long time ago that to please everybody with your Art is almost impossible that is why I admire that He has a real direction and pleases himself.
You are a great artist I wish people could see the incredible complexity of the shapes you use I admire that and I even admit I do not have that level in my line work.
cheers nice Alberto!


Process Junkie said...

Jumpman Well, here's my point: I don't think I have ever given the impression on this blog or anywhere else that I'm above criticism, I don't think I am and I don't think anyone is, in fact when I first created this blog I struggled with the notion of allowing people to post their comments, mainly because I don't get off on people kissing my ass, I used to post heavily on the Shane Glines' board and at one point it became an "Alberto love fest" while I most certainly appreciated the praise I felt as if the art was no longer the most important thing, it became secondary to my personality, popularity in that forum or a combination thereby, I allowed the comments on my blog to be made because I do value an honest opinion, an insightful criticism that can provoke thought and invite further examination or even change, an exchange of ideas kind of thing and so far I've had all that (along with the ass kissing, which again, I'm grateful for, only because I know certain individuals enjoy what I do and want to express their feelings, this being no different than me posting an encouraging word of support on another artist's blog, whose work I truly admire) I do believe that we must celebrate the outstanding work and the people who create rather than the ones who destroy, just as much as we denounce the mediocre and the pretentious and condemn the philistine. The Scribblettes blog has no comments section for the same reason, I wanted the art to be the player, not the personality, I sincerely need no more pads on the back, let me assure you, they don't motivate me artistically, I don't view art as a competitive sport either, winning approval of the masses means nothing to me, you'll never see my work in an art competition of any kind, some people like it some don't. I don't fault you for asking that question because you don't know me, however, assuming that I only want people who are going to pat me on the back to post here ...well, that's another issue.
If you'd ever get to read some of the comments made in the past year and my responses to them, you'd realize that your assumption is unfounded, I defend my opinions passionately, the way one should live his life but my ego is not that big to not listen to reasonable criticism offered without ill will.

I've realized a long time ago that what one says has an effect on how someone perceives what one does, to prove my point (to myself) I posted once a drawing of a hard-core prostitute in the nude and when asked about the identity of the poser, I said it was a portrait of my wife, all of the sudden a picture that was once mundane became sublime and even romantic to people who had read the information, people started to see all kinds of things in it, my love for her, my compassion, etc. etc. while those who were never told, were not as impressed or "moved" by it, they just saw a decent or poor drawing. I have conducted similar experiments with students, regarding time and intention and sure enough the information being given beforehand had an effect on the art and how people perceived a particular piece.

The information in this case being "my self-professed (alleged) love for women", knowing that I don't overtly and purposedly exploit women for monetary gain may change someone's opinion regarding my drawings or my character, or in this case, an individual can take what I wrote and use it to direct a malicious comment at my person, perhaps questioning my integrity and my true intentions (if the intent was that malicious that is) or posing an absurd and ridiculous question; just how in god's name are you supposed to answer that "question" ? What does my love for women have to do with drawing "real faces"?, How is that relevant? these are half cartoon half realistic, sometimes more one thing than the other, caricatures of women I know, or fantasies of women I've never met. What does he consider "real"? Does he mean realistic?? Does it matter that I prefer cartoons over realistic faces?? Was that the question??

If the person had really read what I wrote -and he claims he did- he also would have read that I'm aware that most people don't get what I do and that this fact does not bother me in the least, I am totally fine with people not liking my work, I don't claim my work to be real, I don't claim anything other than "I do this for my own pleasure" I share it with you, as-is.

I took exception to the condescending tone, the anonymous cheap shot, perhaps I've read too much into it, perhaps language has something to do with it, but if so, why not act like a man, step out of the shadows and attempt to clear the misunderstanding. By the IP address I gathered he/she is from Queretaro-Mexico, why not write it in spanish then and avoid an unpleasant encounter, I'm at the defensive at all times, that may be a flaw in my character but that's the only way I know, if you poke me with a stick I'll turn around and slash your throat, before you'll get a chance to slash mine, sounds too harsh but that's a reality, if you're kind towards me I will overwhelm you with kindness, sounds too soft but that's also a reality, I'm old fashioned like that, or maybe just old.

Art is subjective to people's individual tastes and likes, what's "real" to me could be mierda to you and that's perfectly OK, I have no problem with people not finding my drawings (or parts of my drawings appealing to their unique tastes) What I can't tolerate is laziness, cowardice, anonymity and immunity, it could be a language thing, but even so, it comes across as patronizing and insulting at worst and obscure and ignorant at best.

Just for the record: Scott Kurtz is my friend and he is a kind man, I give him the benefit of the doubt over some fanboy or girl, I don't consider myself a star and I don't owe anybody anything. -oh, and I'm not angry, I just write that way :) Thanks for the comment.

VirginiaYou sweet thing, thank you!

The Original Dangster LOL!! Even you have more class than this clown, and you barely have any class :) Thanks Mr. D

Rubén Hay que ser muy poco varón para esconderse y golpear a mansalva. El comentario del tipo aquel me tiene sin cuidado, el anonimato en cambio me rompe los huevos.
Que pasa Rubén ? Acaso la gente ya no tiene clase ni dignidad o será que nosotros somos muy viejos y esas son costumbres de antaño?

Gracias por tu solidaridad!

Process Junkie said...

Antonio: I almost forgot about you, thanks,man! Check this out, something my daughter did El Chavo

The Original Dangster said...

Ya can't have Class, without an ASS...I gotta hold it down!


Process Junkie said...

foeruUrbanBarbarian: I'd call you Tom Cruise LOL!

Dangster: Very clever!...Gosh, you're such a romantic.


jumpman said...

Hey Alberto,

Just to clarify... based on our discussion of new year resolutions, my assumption about you was that you ARE a person who doesn't mind 'questions'. The comment was perhaps a little rhetorical. And, besides, as I was thinking things over last night, it is your blog; you can do what you like.

As for Scott: I wasn't saying he isn't a nice guy, or that the fanboy/girl didn't deserve it. My point was more that his 'comments' formed my first impression of him, and rightly or wrongly every time I go near PvP in the comic store, that's what I remember.

Please don't get me wrong. I don't question your integrity, your motivation for your art, or your reasons for why you created these blogs. I guess I was coming from the point of view of a fan, one who admires so much of everything you create. And being one of these people who looks up to you, I know how crushed and disappointed I would feel if I said the wrong thing and got torched.

And perhaps this is the real issue, both with things relating to Thec and Scott. While artists are often at the mercy of the (all too often unfair) criticism of fans, we fans are at the mercy of the artists. We look to you who have this amazing talent and lament our own puny scribblings and mediocre creations; we're inspired by you to practise and become better; we talk to our friends and rave about your work.

In the end it's a funny relationship, perceived by both the artist and the admirer as unequal. But in reality it may be more equal than we think.

To clear up one more point: while I haven't bought PvP, I've still checked out Scott's work and avidly read his interview in Draw! magazine.

Anyway, sorry for turning this whole thing into a giant bout of contemplation and introspection. I promise I'll go back to just posting short, witty comments!!! :)

Love what you do.


Process Junkie said...

Jumpman Nothing to apologize for, I know you're not slamming Scott, I gathered that much from your comment. See, this is the best example of a comment (the original one made by you) that invites a healthy argument and what you aptly and fairly called a giant bout of contemplation and introspection, I welcome this type of interaction, I seek it, really! I mean that wholeheartedly, not as a mere compliment to you.

A couple of weeks? ago or so, I was having a similar conversation with John Beatty, a regular here, someone who has become a dear friend of mine, and -as you can tell already- I don't know when to shup up so we talked for nearly 6 hours straight over the phone, at one point in the conversation, John aslked me a question I didn't know how to answer, it became obvious to me at that point that having the blog had made me aware of a slew of things about myself, both as a person and as an artist, things that would have never occurred to me otherwise, basic questions I probably would have never asked myself, I guess I've never had the need to find out; it never fails, while attempting to answer a question, (leaving all the rock star posturing and PR bullshit aside) I embark on an instrospective journey, it is just at that moment that I begin to honestly interrogate myself and search for the real reasons why I do whatever it is that I do, so we basically are founding out much of this stuff together, so you (the audience) are just as much a part of the process as I am. It is just then that I truly begin to understand or make sense rather of a lot of my own shortcomings, virtues (if any) and the causes and effects of many of my actions.

I do beg of you to not just post the witty comments, your opinions are appreciated and your questions had initiated plenty of contemplation and self-examination which I can't thank you enough for, I have discovered or uncovered a few things about my character that are less than flattering and some petty shit I didn't think I was capable of. While we won't always agree on everything there is a basic common ground we both share, otherwise you would have stopped coming to my blog a long time ago.

Your comments are valid, trouble is, I tend to come off as a pitbull defending my turf, ready to torch anyone who doesn't agree with me -that's clearly one of my shortcomings, unfortunately my experiences with people are much to blame for this behavior-, nothing can be further from the truth, in person I'm just as passionate but people can read me better or rather, I can better make an argument without coming across as an egotistical jerk -which I always knew I was- :).

I disagree with you when it comes to this "fan" business, I do not perceive you or anyone who comes to this blog as a fan, not even Dan Panosian, who's claiming to be a fanboy. This is my theory, hear me out:

It is my strong belief (and I have said many times but people think it's just a marketing line) that the regular "fan" of comics or otherwise, does not care for my stuff, I am positively certain, without being presumptuous, that a particular common element is present in everyone who enjoys what I do, or who finds it appealing, that may be aesthethics, philosophy of action, approach at problem solving, technique, etc, etc. Most people who are drawn to my images are either artists, designers, animators or have some sort of artistic tendency and a particular inclination to certain ideal of beauty, of form or whatever it may be. The fanboy who comes for the "pussy in your face" leaves disappointed after a few pictures. This is not something planned on my part, it's just the way it is, my close friends think I must be rich from selling all these books I self-publish, they're all artists so they naively think everyone must like these drawings as well as they do. I do OK for myself because there are plenty of artists or artistic types out there who buy the books and come to the conventions, but it is not a mass audience type of product, plain and simple.

Most comic creators and people like Scott appeal to the masses for many different reasons, so they DO have fans, I can never see myself doing what they do because it's not my aspiration to appeal to anyone other than myself. I don't slam these creators for having the common touch and for appealing to a broader audience, but that is just not me. You, as a self-described fan, are not at the mercy of the artists, however, you are so right when you say the artist is at the mercy of the fan, because the fans buy their product and without their economic support the artist might find it hard to continue, nowhere this is more apparent than in the business of comics, where the fans pretty much dictate what's being produced, DC and Marvel are constantly watering down their product and bastardizing their properties to lower themselves to the misinformed fanboy level in order to get into their pockets, that's why there's so much garbage out there. If all the Babyman want is photoshop airbrushed tits & ass and crude fart jokes, that's all these companies will produce, the exceptions are very few. Me, I like T&A of a different kind, not the kind the fanboy wants, except for Dan Panosian :)

For any successful relationship to be such, there has to be a common bond or interest, being humans that interest usually is an economic one, so that whole "fan"/artist relationship you speak of does not apply to me whatsoever since I have taken the economic element out of that equation, I don't depend on the fan for my income, therefore I am not obligated, I see you and the people who buy my books as equals in many respects, mostly because we share that elusive sensitivity or sensibility, mainly an aesthetic one, criticism of any kind other than of a constructive nature then, at this level really has no place.


Charles said...

Alberto you rebel!!! From someone who 'gets'
you-- nice sketch!!!


thec said...

Actually, I asked a real question, it was not slamming or condemning at all. The previous poster got it right in that I was not communicating what I meant very well (it was late at night).

Rereading my post, I can see it was the misuse of the word 'supposedly' which made my comment come out harsh. Trust me, it was not meant to be. Apologies.

And btw - in my opinion you are an incredible artist. I'm a female and find your representation quite powerful. So no, I am not here as some sleazy guy wanting more and getting miffed due to the lack. I visit because I appreciate your work.

But even with your long explanation I can see you don't like any criticism (and if you look it what I wrote it's quite mild), so I'll leave off the posting and just stick with the watching. Apologies again for getting your dander up.

cheers ...

Process Junkie said...

I've already stated among other things-that perhaps I've read too much into it, and that is my flaw in character to jump at anything that I perceive condescending or insulting, for that I apologize profusely, but you must admit your question was rather bizarre to say the least and the way it was phrased allowed for plenty of misunderstanding. I understand you might be mad at me for expressing my thoughts but, I would ask you to reconsider and re-establish the dialog, obviously the language is not a barrier for you as you have very eloquently expressed your point of view this time in a clear and concise manner. I forgive you for the first comment if you forgive my stupid rants, is that fair? . . . . I still would love to hear where you are coming from and what you meant the firat time, perhaps I can learn a thing or two about behaving like a human being and not jumping to conclusions. If you'd rather discuss it in private you can email me. You must have by now a pretty good idea of how I think, do you honestly think I don't welcome constructive criticism? I hope we can repair this, because like I said to Jumpman, I don't think of the people who visit here regularly as fans, if you are reasonable, and I think you are, Please let me make it up to you and let's engage in a healthy dialog.


antonio said...

Damn Sorry to write down again but..
I already read the last batch of posts and THEC got misunderstood, great to see She made herself clear.
Alberto have a great day and Talk to you later!!


Process Junkie said...

Deep inside, she knows I love her, time will heal her wounds, now I have to work hard to earn back her trust and forgiveness.

Thec, dearest, wherever you are, I'm thinking of you, come back to me, I promise things will be different next time, I swear. Give me just one more chance to prove my love to you, I can change, I'll be gentler, kinder, you can call me names too if you want. What we had was really special, I know you care, you know I'm a big goof (and a big ass) I did the same thing to Greg Thompson and now we're best of friends. The counselor was right, he said I needed to control my anger, I should have listened to him...but..I can change...I promise, I will take the blue pills. I'll send you a free T-shirt, the only medium size I have. . . OK, OK, 2 T-shirts but that's it! write back, I'm in pain :((

thec said...

You are very forgivable (and indeed sweet) in your replies. I do agree the way I phrased my question left much to be desired and could give grief. Apologies again.

I’m also an artist (portrait) and this very night wondered how my reaction would have been, given the same circumstances turned. When training to learn my skill I ran the critique gauntlet which has left me with a little man on my shoulder who witters on to this day. So please believe my heart, in that what I had in my head was not what presented itself to you that very late night.

Yes, let us forgive the rocky start and begin again. No blue pills, t-shirts or private corner needed. Just a click of the keys so’s not to leave all questioning what I was actually trying to say, in that my misplaced sputtering was not meant as a thing of cruelty, but a personal observation.

And I’m still not sure if I can explain as well as I desire to in order to be understood without coming off as unnecessarily critical as in truth, I'm not.

This method of communication lacks warmth to those such as myself who’s thoughts sometime cannot be forced where wished.

The night in question I had been cruising through your works (I have your blog on a feed to keep you at my finger tips) and it struck me that your female bodies were sculpted with fabulous care and much supreme power (sometimes masculine, but not in a male way). But in comparison, some faces (no, not all), although magnificent on their own, were more cartoon like rather than injected with the strength you’d enveloped their physique.

But in saying this, they are truly fine pieces of works. And as I said before, I honestly admire your talent as it has a potency that thrills and gives me (as well as others) much pleasure as is.

Process Junkie said...

Dearest Thec,

I was thinking the same while trying to figure out what you meant to say originally. That is, that a lot of the bodies are much more realistic than their faces, as a matter of fact I think I briefly mentioned it in an earlier tirade, that's what I thought you asked but I wasn't sure. This question has a couple of answers, the main reason is that when I draw I want to merge the cartoony with the realistic, because I love traditional academic figure drawing and I adore cartoons, in my post of January 06 I said what I do is my ideal, is a mix of women,cartoons, graphic design, etc. etc., and everything else that interests me, sculpture, architecture, engineering and whatever else.

I love to experiment with my drawings, injecting a bit of each discipline into them, most often subconsciously, if you look at some of these carefully you'll notice that some drawings have a more animated feel to them, some are more rigid and structured and resemble diagrams and so on and so forth, the thing is I can't always control the amount of one thing or another, inevitably a lot of these women will end up as freaks, mutants, hybrids or whatever you wish to call them, some experiments work fine and some look very odd. Sometimes i just want to see how far can I take something without breaking it, this happents quite a lot, some girls end up having legs that resemble horses and faces that resemble coal miners. It doesn't bother me none but I can see why it may bother some people. Even though I know where I want to take my drawings I don't really sit and plan them, I let them flow and I go wherever they may take me, the only thing constant in my drawings (i'd like to believe) is that I try to give them a solid foundation, their proper placement in space, regardless of style and of how far the forms and perspective are pushed, I strongly believe that for a super stylized drawing to work, it must be anchored to a set of sound physics principles, a lot of artists push the forms but they forget these principles and the resulting work (although stylish) seems like it melts or floats on the page, not the intemtion, Im sure.

Another reason is I draw most of the women's faces from memory, even if the bodies are drawn from live models (this pisses the models off big time, to whom the main concern is to see themselves being immortalized). Sometimes I draw from photos and again I would draw my own faces unless I'm totally taken by what I see. I have said that everytime I draw strictly from my head something very cartoony and strange happens.

I'm glad you came back to me, you made the right choice, just wait and see how happy we'll be this time around, I will be king one day and you will rule alongside me. I know you realize as well as I do that we were born to be together, it's destiny. . . . What was your name again?


Un abrazote para tí, muah!
Your most loving and humble servant.
Viva el Amor!!

manucha said...

Mr. Ruiz,
You do have a way with words, in spite of the temper. But most of all Mr. Ruiz, you know the ways to softening a woman’s heart. The temper in this case is good, for it’s to me, a reflection of humanness (being you), perhaps a line for bait (even non-intended), that is, for stimulating conversations and/or criticisms, no pun intended. You’ve reflected balance throughout these exchanges of dialog. Except for the buttering up of the mysterious woman. Could it be coincidental that it’s “The Wrong Girl?” taken “The Wrong Way?” I’ve truly enjoyed observing the irony of give and take in this posting. Great info. for thought this week.

I think the beauty of this form of E-communication poses several benefits and challenges. In this case one is, the challenge of creative expression.

The motivation of the individual in taking the time to process their thoughts, write, read & re-read & re-write, add/delete shows the amount of conscious effort for whatevah tickles their fancy, to post their expression.

I think part of the challenge is to learn in being creative with words and/or allowing self-expression.

I do agree this method of E-communication can seem to lack levels of emotion expressed, but I think what is truly underlying is more towards the connection on a physical level with “the person”. For ultimately our animalistic side of being is in connecting, even if it's a click away.

Process Junkie said...

Couldn't have said it better mahself!

You know, I was reflecting upon that too, the "Wrong Girl" in the end is a poetic (fitting) title to this post. She's very sweet and a really good sport.

What's truly ironic, is that my friend Greg Thompson, with whom I had a similar encounter with (meaning I jumped on his throat first and asked questions later) visited me
the night before, I'll tell you that story some other time. Suffice to say we have become really good friends after we met in person a year ago, it turns out we're pretty much the same type of individual.

Now you believe me when I say that the people who are regulars here and myself share a bond that trascends petty squabbles and silly misunderstandings, these people are not fans to me, they are friends, and of all people you know how much that word means to me. Call me a softie but I think they all can sense this common bond when they look at the drawings, I hope they do, it's there somewhere.

That's the problem with us, latinos, we're too sentimental, -sniff-


jumpman said...